Idea Futures meme spreads

Way back in '95, those wacky and ever-inventive Extropians created a web-based implementation of an idea that was apparently first presented in a 1991 paper by Robin Hanson, something they called "idea futures." The general concept is that people bet on the likelihood of a given predicted event happening, and pure market dynamics are supposed to result in a reasonably good "expert consensus" of that likelihood.

The first web implementation was known simply as "Idea Futures"; it's since transformed into the Foresight Exchange, and appears to still be going strong after about eight years. I played the original version briefly, but got distracted before I could become too immersed in it. One thing I recall about it was that the exact phrasing and details of a given claim/prediction made a big difference; a claim titled Human Clone before 2005, for example, specifies that the clone must live to one year of age, which might have a big effect on how likely one thinks the claim is. I rather liked IF for the brief time I played it, partly because it gave me a slightly better idea of the basics of how a stock market worked, which I'd been previously entirely ignorant of.

I'm not sure whether Jay is still an active FX player (he was the one who introduced me to the concept, iIrc), but it appears that his autonomous robot player, Markybot, is still playing.

Anyway, the reason all this comes to mind is that Fred points out that the Pentagon has become interested in the concept; at a cost of only $3 million, they intend to create a global idea futures exchange called the Policy Analysis Market to get advance warning on acts of terrorism and such. In the Bloomberg article, DARPA is quoted as saying: "Prices and spreads signal probabilities and confidence.... Since markets provide incentives for good judgment and self-selection, the market will effectively aggregate information among knowledgeable participants."

I'm still a little unclear about how to get from a market-based consensus opinion on the likelihood of an event to "market-based techniques for avoiding surprise and predicting future events"; it seems unlikely to me that the people with any real knowledge of details will engage in trading in this market, which suggests to me that this is basically a high-tech way of taking a poll. But there may well be lots of details I'm unaware of. DARPA says that this approach has been successful at predicting things like movie box office success and the outcomes of elections. (Though again I would note that in those situations, people who participate in the market may also be involved in determining the outcome, such as by voting in an election or attending (or staying home from) a movie. So this again starts to look like a sophisticated polling technique, which is a lot less useful when the people who are going to take the relevant actions aren't in your polling sample.)

10 Responses to “Idea Futures meme spreads”

  1. David Moles

    It’s the market! It’s magic! What are you, some kind of communist?

    — If the idea takes off, I’m sure there will be a certain amount of insider trading. But I’m not sure I like the idea of speculative bubbles on a DARPA-run market for future terrorist attacks. What happens when they try to prick one?

    Actually, if I was a terrorist — especially a rich one — I might deliberately try to run up a speculative bubble over an attack I wasn’t planning to commit, in order to distract the people who think the prices on the market actually mean something….

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  2. Vardibidian

    Didn’t John Brunner write about something quite like on-line idea futures in Shockwave Rider in 1975? Or am I misremembering? Sometimes I just assume that any half-baked internet-related idea is from that book, and I sure as heck ain’t going back and re-reading it.

    Redintegro Iraq,
    -Vardibidian.

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  3. JeremyT

    “I’m not sure whether Jay is still an active FX player (he was the one who introduced me to the concept, iIrc), but it appears that his autonomous robot player, Markybot, is still playing.”

    Jesus. I’m living in the future. That is the most SFnal thing I’ve seen anyone write all month.

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  4. myob1

    The basic difference between the DARPA scheme and other such markets is that a single participant can both participate in the market and make an event happen. One moviegoer is not about to affect the fortunes of the latest blockbuster, nor can the average investor affect the price of a share of stock. One nut-job, however, with the right equipment and the right set of circumstances, can wreak havoc.

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  5. Vardibidian

    Oh, and if this AP report is about the thing you are talking about, it’s dead.

    Redintegro Iraq,
    -Vardibidian.

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  6. Jed

    Thanks for the update, Vardibidian! That AP article is a little weird, though—the first half of it says the scheme’s been called off, while the second half talks about how it’s going to be implemented and funded. My guess is that an overzealous reporter or editor just pasted in the second half of a previous story on this topic.

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  7. David Moles

    There was something like that in Shockwave Rider — based on the alleged principle that if you ask a large number of people, say, what’s the population of Indianapolis, the results will tend to cluster around the right answer. Nice idea, but given, e.g., the percentages of poll respondents apparently believing things like the US having found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, I’d like to see the original research.

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  8. Rachel Heslin

    I read Shockwave Rider for the first time a few months ago (my dad gave me his old SFBC collection) and kept having to check the publication date in astonishment at the book’s precognition.

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  9. Nick Mamatas

    Woohoo, I just won $50 on the “Will the terrorist prediction futures market be DOA” futures market!

    Banana splits for everybody!

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  10. Jed

    That’s nothing—I just won $100 on the “Will Nick win $50 on the ‘Will the terrorist prediction futures market be DOA’ futures market” futures market!

    But no banana splits; I’m gonna bet again reinvest (in some other scheme).

    …But seriously, I actually do think it’s interesting that Foresight Exchange (FX) plays with meta-futures, people betting that various things relating to the game will or won’t happen, etc. I gather there are real-world stock market analogies, but they make my head hurt. It’s also interesting to me that (it seems to me, though I could be wrong) people who do well at the FX game are as likely to be good at guessing what the consensus opinion will be over time, as to be good at guessing what the future will actually be per se. If you can guess what the market’s going to do, it’s irrelevant what the facts are that the market’s responding to. Yes, there are obvious real-world analogies here as well. Maybe I really just mean that a toy stock market where you can more easily see what’s going on is more fun for an amateur like me to watch than the real thing.

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